Curse

Badger2 · May 22, 2006, 06:41 PM // 18:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter Sharparrow

I'm pretty sure that you have to do the Sanctum Cay mission to access the desert. You also have to do all three ascention missions to get ascended and that you have to get ascended to have access to the UW and FoW. You also have to beat THK (I believe that's the one) to access the 'volcano islands' (as I like to call it). While there you have to do the last three missions in the game in order completing one to access the next. No skipping ahead and no access if you lose. There are more than just these too.

Doh, having played, I knew that. *insert approiate embarrassed emot*

Hunter Sharparrow · May 22, 2006, 07:10 PM // 19:10

Quote:

It's much more effective to get a point across without referring to one individuals (mine in this instance) as a general "mindset." I was reiterating that case by stating the same "generalization" on the flip side.

Do you seriously think that post was based off anything you said? The part you quoted if you look carefully at the first line I asked a question. If you must know it wasn't your post Loralai that inspired that part of the post but rather the following post:

Quote:

Your suggestion would drive even more people away from Alliance battles.

Fort Aspenwood is a PvP mission exclusive to PvE characters. Let's consider that one of the driving forces behind people playing it is to get faction. If Alliance battles become an even more undesirable method of getting Kurzick/Luxon faction, even less people will bother playing it.

Less people playing it, less games.

PvE focused players won't bother because there will be far better ways to get faction. PvP focused players won't bother because there will be far better ways to get a game going in other avenues of PvP. Those that provide them with Balthazar Faction, Rank, or Guild standing I might add.

Take a look at the part in bold then look at the question I asked in the first part you quoted from my post.

However if that is the game you want to play. I can play.

GET OVER YOURSELF. NOT EVERYTHING IS ABOUT YOU.

Edit:

One can only assume that if you believed that it was directed to you or based off anything you said that you would have to have the same opinion as the person who posted saying people would stop playing it. That is the reason I named no names and didn't quote any post just prior to say such things (or in this case, asked such questions). That I was sure more than just that person posting on this thread was thinking the same thing. So you were not only wrong to assume it was in direct response to you or anything you posted but you are also wrong that it is in direct response of any one person's view.

Loralai · May 22, 2006, 08:07 PM // 20:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter Sharparrow

Do you seriously think that post was based off anything you said? The part you quoted if you look carefully at the first line I asked a question. If you must know it wasn't your post Loralai that inspired that part of the post but rather the following post:

One can only assume that if you believed that it was directed to you or based off anything you said that you would have to have the same opinion as the person who posted saying people would stop playing it.

NO, one can reasonably assume that if you quote me in your post and then use the terms YOU, you, you, that it is directed to me. Reread your own post.

Hunter Sharparrow · May 22, 2006, 08:19 PM // 20:19

Quote:

NO, one can reasonably assume that if you quote me in your post and then use the terms YOU, you, you, that it is directed to me. Reread your own post.

OMG I quoted you after an edit. AN EDIT! The paragraph that followed was the only one based off what you said and only the one part I quoted. It also wasn't even directed to you. I was addressing Ira and all i said was that I understood and gave an example of what happened to me since I saw the same thing happening to him in this thread. Note in this post I quoted you to start off. That means the paragraph to follow is based off that. Although it may not be the case all the time. Though I really shouldn't have to point this out.

lightblade · May 22, 2006, 08:29 PM // 20:29

lol, there's already not enough people playing in there...

no reward to losing side will just make even less people go there

Witchblade · May 22, 2006, 08:51 PM // 20:51

there are no ways of getting factions already.
stupidest petition ever !!
/not fu**ing signed

Big_Iron · May 22, 2006, 08:58 PM // 20:58

/not signed

Ira Blinks · May 22, 2006, 09:06 PM // 21:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightblade

lol, there's already not enough people playing in there...

no reward to losing side will just make even less people go there

who will quit? Those who come there to farm faction (leechers and losers)? Oh I'm so going to cry about that...

Sientir · May 22, 2006, 09:07 PM // 21:07

/notsigned

Man, so much hostility in this thread. FYI: You do lose something for losing a GvG. You lose rating. Rating makes rank. Just thought I'd point that out, since it seems like EVERYONE was ignoring it.

At any rate, I like getting something for my effort. Let me follow with this:
Any other form of PvP (HA, TA, RA, GvG) gives you faction with Balthazar when you kill someone. While flawlesses are possible, there are certainly many times when this isn't the case. So, even if you lose, YOU STILL GET SOMETHING. Maybe not as much as the winners, but you usually do get at least some faction. The way that these work, however, is that you get the faction after the mission is completed, either as a failure or as a victory.

I don't know. There is something to me in the way that Ira is talking here that seems, well, a little bit overzealous. I'm sorry if you find it offensive, but that is just how I'm preceiving you from your posts.

Leechers, afkers, what have you, exist because people are lazy, that is true. People do prefer the easiest route. So does electricity. Anyway...I'd like to see Jade Arena played. But it really isn't, because Faction awards there are apparently trivial. Causing penalties, etc. for leavers/afkers/losers won't necessarily help much. Especially penalties for losing. People don't want to be hurt for losing at this sort of thing, and that will drive many many people away.

Overall, the issue is quite complex. How do you best please the most people? That is challenging, and it is impossible to please everyone. So, not everyone will like how things are done.

Ira Blinks · May 22, 2006, 09:35 PM // 21:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sientir

I don't know. There is something to me in the way that Ira is talking here that seems, well, a little bit overzealous. I'm sorry if you find it offensive, but that is just how I'm preceiving you from your posts.

Let me get this straight. I am getting very annoyed yes, but that is only because of flaming I was getting for no good reason.

1) Some guy jumps is and says my idea is very bad. I ask why. He never replies.
When it happens third time in a row im getting pissed.

2) Some guy says there are better ways to farm faction. I say well if you only care about faction then go and farm repeatable quests. Why are you here? He gets all defensive and claims I know nothing about this game. Im getting pissed.

3) Some guy says it will drive people off. I ask why. And who are those people that will leave? He gives me blind look and repeats same stupid thing again. I'm getting pissed.

4) I'm trying to explain some guy my idea. He turns my words inside out, add something I never said, intentionally misunderstands things and then claims I say nonsense. I go like wtf... oh yes, and ofcourse I'm getting pissed.

5) Some guy says it will be harder to play because people will be quitting. Say how is this different from now? Leechers are effctively quitters on their own, except that they get faction for it. Plus on top of that they generate extra quitters who dont want to play for them. He abandons this thread of agrument, just so the next guy few posts below could repeat the same thing... And again I'm getting pissed.

6) Tenth guy in a row says that we need some afk detection code. I don't even bother replying anymore, i'm getting pissed silently.

7) Some guy calls me names, tells me I don't know how to play, and then says I have problems with attitude. I'm getting pissed and loosing faith in humanity.

8) Some idiot posts some bullpie, which clearly indicates that he is one of those leechers sucking my blood in Aspenwood. Suprisingly I just ignore that altogether.

lightblade · May 22, 2006, 09:38 PM // 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ira Blinks

who will quit? Those who come there to farm faction (leechers and losers)? Oh I'm so going to cry about that...

And you think there's no "leechers and losers" in alliance battles?

"leechers and losers" are everywhere!
You see them in Random Arena!
You see them in Alliance Battle!
You see them in Story Mission!

So stop crying about that!

Ira Blinks · May 22, 2006, 09:42 PM // 21:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightblade

And you think there's no "leechers and losers" in alliance battles?

"leechers and losers" are everywhere!
You see them in Random Arena!
You see them in Alliance Battle!
You see them in Story Mission!

So stop crying about that!

there another good example why I'm having problems with attitude.

Overnite · May 22, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

The only thing that this "awesome idea" would accomplish is making half of the people leave in 2 minutes after the game starts- there's no point in wasting 10 minutes by playing in a team that seems to be losing, it's easier to find a new one.

And it won't even damage the leechers, because if you leave a bot running for the entire night then you'll score 10.000 Faction anyway.

Hurricane · May 22, 2006, 10:00 PM // 22:00

/notsigned

Better ways to fix the leecher problem.

Slimcea · May 22, 2006, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Removing faction gain for people losing will simply add to people who ragequit. Why? As so many other people have explained, the losing side has nothing to play for. Why continue to bother to try with nothing to gain? At the first sign of losing, the weaker team will just bail out since there's no point in staying.

As for the difference between an AFK leecher and a ragequitter, well quite simply, its this - there's the possibility that the AFK leecher might come back or simply act as a additional meatshield. In either case, how sure are you that the opposition doesn't have a similar if not greater number of AFK-ers? Simply ragequitting is giving up without even properly understanding the situation. Staying behind to fight might give leechers some faction, but on the other hand, you're in it for the fight not the faction, so why give a damn about the AFKers?

In either case, people who ragequit at the first sign of something that displeases them are much more offensive than those who AFK, and just only slightly better than griefers. Quitting is giving up without a fight, without even bothering to try. Faced with a handicap? Why not give it your best shot? You might always win, and a loss in any case doesn't reflect too badly on yourself. And what about the remaining players who are giving it their best? Ragequitting is simply abandoning them and quite frankly reflects very badly on the player.

In fact, I'd rather penalise ragequitters of any sort than remove faction for AFK players, let alone the losing side.

Badger2 · May 22, 2006, 10:54 PM // 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sientir

FYI: You do lose something for losing a GvG. You lose rating. Rating makes rank. Just thought I'd point that out, since it seems like EVERYONE was ignoring it.

Having no desire to ever play PvP-GvG, or what ever, in GW:P, how does loosing that rank effect the PvE environment there? Unless I'm mistaken even loosing rank you can still take a PvE toon and go anywhere and do anything in that PvE environment. Where as in GW:F if your PvE toon is not in a guild alliance that has the necessary faction to control a town or outpost you don't get the benefit of lower merchant prices and the fireworks display never mind not being able to control one of the "l33t" mission cities, which, I suppose is Factions version of FoW/UW and I do not find entertaining and there for am not going to grind to gain the faction so that I can play with the "l33t".

If the deffination of a casual player is based on available time of game play then I do not fit that defination. Because I can and do spend atleast 3 hrs a night playing during the week. In GW:P that time was spent going around the country side seeing what I can see and killing whatever I come upon and running missions when ever I wanted to, to get the necessary xp to advance in the game. This, for me, is fun and entertaining and why I started playing GW in the first place. I didn't have to ceaselessly beat my head against the PvP wall to get anywhere.

Having recently completed the game with only the initialy required 10k faction and on only one side I will most likely take this toon to Tyria. Where there are no restrictions on where I can go or what I can do and when I can do it. Granted I can't yet play any of the missions prior to LA but there are plenty of mission/quests and wide open spaces between LA and Hells Precipas (sp?).

Ira Blinks · May 22, 2006, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slimcea

Removing faction gain for people losing will simply add to people who ragequit.

lol what?
Ever seen 3-4 people quit at start? I see that all the time. This IS because of leechers.

Quote:

Why? As so many other people have explained, the losing side has nothing to play for. Why continue to bother to try with nothing to gain? At the first sign of losing, the weaker team will just bail out since there's no point in staying.

Me and some other people already answered there IS something to play for. VICTORY! If you are not there for it, then why are you there? Go farm your faction from repeatable quests and let those who want to fight have their fun, period. This is the ultimate place for lots of people like me who could never get into HA because of rank/profession discrimination and does not belong to good GvG guild. Leave us alone, you griefers.

Sientir · May 22, 2006, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Badger2

Having no desire to ever play PvP-GvG, or what ever, in GW:P, how does loosing that rank effect the PvE environment there?

The relation was the comparisons people were making with other forms of PvP, such as HA, etc, claiming that there is no form of PvP where you can lose something by losing. At least, that is what I recall picking up on my initial reading of the thread.

EternalTempest · May 22, 2006, 11:22 PM // 23:22

/not signed

Reason is this OP is slightly flawed, want one control / conquest city to not earn points vs the other 4 to stop leachers / bots earning faction in that one battle zone.

I think it would disrupt throw out of wack Anets system for faction gaiming to try and stop a different problem (that's been around for a long time).

Terra Xin · May 23, 2006, 12:18 AM // 00:18

Im convinced that noone reads what people say in this thread... totally

OK. let's start by saying

/notsigned

Now, let me clarify the reasons why:

1) Having people stay in the battle for the full 10 minutes not only grants them a runners up prize, but by staying you're giving your team a better chance at winning, and even if you still lose, it would have been a closer match.

2) Follow up on no. 1. People leave PvP arenas because they die... like... once. Knowing that there is no loss if they leave knowing that they are going to lose, Aspenwood, Jade quarry and that other area discourages people to leave.

It really doesnt matter whether or not you gain faction for losing, you're either going to have idle leechers, or rage quitters + leechers. At least with the consellation prize, you get rid of the quitters.

The answer to a better solution? Anet has trouble handling farming bots, now they have to deal with these suckers... please... they should devote a team designed on minor improvements, bug fixes and bot removals, but I doubt they could afford another team... go figure.

- note: you really cant compare these areas to PvP, PvE characters take a while to develop, it's not like you're gonna get some test PvPer joining battles and dying in an instant.